Casual Temple

TRANSCRIPT

(Transcript is auto-generated; errors are unintentional.)

00:00:05 Merrily

Welcome to Casual Temple.

00:00:06 Merrily

This is episode 47 and I'm your host, Merrily Duffy at the casual.

00:00:11 Merrily

Our mission is to discover our connection to the unseen world of spirit and how that empowers us, know our true selves.

00:00:17 Merrily

Want to support our?

00:00:18 Merrily

Subscribe and leave a star review on your favorite podcast platform. We love hearing from you, so visit casualtemple.com to share your thoughts.

00:00:25 Merrily

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00:00:29 Merrily

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00:00:32 Merrily

This week, our most awesome guest.

00:00:34 Merrily

Wilkin Lane is a mambabatok or traditional Filipino tattooist, as well as a cultural historian and author. In this episode, we dive deep into Lange, journey from an unexpected beginning as a Mormon missionary in Hawaii to becoming one of the leading voices in Filipino cultural tattooing. We explore the.

00:00:50 Merrily

And cultural significance of Batok, the ancient connections that emerge during tattoo ceremonies.

00:00:55 Merrily

And the wisdom carried through these sacred markings.

00:00:58 Merrily

Get ready for the enlightening conversation about identity, lineage and the power of reclaiming indigenous traditions.

00:01:04 Merrily

Join us on casual temple for the past is present.

00:01:09 Merrily

Welcome to the casual.

00:01:11 Merrily

This week we are so privileged to host a most awesome guest Lane, Wilckin. Lame is a mambabatok or a traditional Filipino tattooist, tattooist, author of two books, Filipino tattoos ancient to modern.

00:01:25 Merrily

And the forgotten children of Maui is a cultural historian, particularly in the realm of Filipino traditional tattooing and indigenous indigenous spiritual practices.

00:01:35 Merrily

His work sheds light on the symbolism and stories behind these tattoos.

00:01:39 Merrily

Helping individuals reconnect with their roots and honor their Filipino identity.

00:01:43 Merrily

Leo's dedicated his life to uncovering and revitalizing the ancestral knowledge of to create future practitioners and reawaken the spiritual significance of Filipinos now and into the future.

00:01:55 Merrily

Monong lane. I'm beyond excited.

00:01:58 Merrily

Welcome to the welcome you to the casual temple.

00:02:00 Lane

Thank you for having me here.

00:02:02 Merrily

Thank.

00:02:03 Merrily

Oh, gosh, yes. So um.

00:02:07 Merrily

Yeah, I yeah, recently had my batok ceremony with you and your two princesses, Shane and Maya.

00:02:15 Merrily

Are you know you all are just lovely people and it was such a wonderful experience.

00:02:19 Merrily

I basically can't shut up about it. Any any person that I haven't seen in a while gets.

00:02:23 Merrily

Hear the whole stories.

00:02:25 Merrily

It's just been so cool.

00:02:28 Merrily

But yeah, so I know.

00:02:30 Merrily

I know your your story of how you got started, but would you mind sort of, you know, walking us through a little version of that?

00:02:37 Merrily

And start at the beginning.

00:02:41 Lane

Sure. So it's kind of a funny story cause.

00:02:48 Lane

People will ask me a lot, you know, just how did you get started in all of this? And you know what?

00:02:53 Lane

Made you go down this.

00:02:55 Lane

Etcetera. And I say, well, I was a Mormon missionary.

00:03:02 Lane

And they're like what?

00:03:05 Lane

And yeah, so when I was, I grew up and was raised Mormon.

00:03:10

Mm.

00:03:11 Lane

On my dad's side come from a long line of Mormons. I'm no longer a practicing Mormon.

00:03:16 Lane

But when I was 19 years old, I did the whole Mormon missionary.

00:03:21 Lane

Or you wear a white shirt and a tie and you knock on peoples doors and all that kind of stuff.

00:03:27 Lane

But.

00:03:30 Lane

In the Mormon church, the young men are expected to become missionaries and you don't get to pick where you go.

00:03:40 Lane

They just assign you to a place, and so I got assigned to do missionary work in Hawaii. And while I was in Hawaii, there were things that seemed very, very familiar, and I couldn't quite put my finger on it.

00:03:54 Lane

And I thought, you know.

00:03:57 Lane

This feels.

00:03:59 Lane

Oddly familiar, I know I'm not Hawaiian, but something's resonating and.

00:04:06 Lane

I at first I noticed linguistic similarities and then you know, customs practices that were similar. And then I I thought, well, maybe there is some kind of relationship here and this was back in 1989.

00:04:22 Lane

So this is a long time ago.

00:04:25 Lane

Is pre.

00:04:26 Lane

This is, you know, before any genetic studies or anything that show now that there there is a relationship genetically as well as culturally etcetera between the peoples of the Philippines and the peoples of the Pacific.

00:04:40 Lane

Were all Australians speaking people? Australians. Cultures.

00:04:45 Lane

But back then, we didn't have any of.

00:04:47 Lane

You know, Filipinos are usually cubby hold into the category of Asian.

00:04:55 Lane

OK so.

00:04:58 Lane

Yeah. Now, now.

00:04:59 Lane

Know that genetically, linguistically, culturally we we are related to other peoples in the Pacific as Australians speaking cultures.

00:05:08 Lane

Anyway, back then, we didn't have that any of that information, and Filipinos generally were lumped in with SE Asians and.

00:05:19 Lane

All these.

00:05:21 Lane

Designations are Western terms anyway, you know.

00:05:26 Lane

Our ancestors didn't call themselves Asians or Pacific Islanders, or even Filipinos.

00:05:31 Lane

Those are all names that have been given to us, but there was something about Hawaiian culture that really resonated with me and and one of those things.

00:05:41 Lane

That kind of enamored me while I was there was tattoos.

00:05:45 Lane

On a Polynesian cousins, I noticed these beautiful tattoos.

00:05:50 Lane

I had a desire to be tattooed myself, but I didn't want to appropriate anything that didn't belong to me.

00:05:59 Lane

And that's where my research started was when I got done with my missionary work.

00:06:04 Lane

Started doing research and at first it was just.

00:06:09 Lane

You know, looking at commonalities between our different cultures and piercing them together, you know, this is similar to that, you know.

00:06:16 Lane

The word for I in the Philippines.

00:06:19 Lane

It's my birth.

00:06:22 Lane

Day Hawaiian. They just changed the T to AK, they say mafa.

00:06:27 Lane

But I started recording all of these things down in some spiral notebooks, and the notes became papers and the papers became books.

00:06:39 Lane

But.

00:06:41

I really.

00:06:41 Lane

Didn't have any intention of becoming a practitioner. I wanted to get tattooed.

00:06:48 Lane

But I didn't want to do it.

00:06:50 Lane

One reason for that is my religion. At the time, it was still a practicing Mormon.

00:06:59 Lane

And also I didn't feel qualified to do the tattooing because I'm a mixy. My dad is American of English and Scandinavian descent.

00:07:07 Merrily

Mm.

00:07:11 Lane

Mom's from the Philippines.

00:07:13 Lane

And so I was pretty hesitant to do that.

00:07:16 Lane

Was happy to sit.

00:07:20 Lane

In the role of a scholar or researcher.

00:07:24 Lane

Didn't want to do any of the practice and my mentor at the time.

00:07:27 Lane

The what they call Nunes of Hawaii.

00:07:31 Lane

He was like, you've got to you got to write all this stuff down. You have to publish these books, because if.

00:07:40 Lane

You know, if you die, Lane, what's going to happen to all that?

00:07:43 Lane

You've accumulated over the years and it kind of shamed me into publishing the the first book.

00:07:45 Merrily

Right.

00:07:51 Lane

And so I got it.

00:07:53 Lane

I almost didn't publish it because I just thought who's going to be interested in ancient types of tattooing.

00:08:00 Lane

Know this. This seems very niche.

00:08:04 Lane

But he encouraged.

00:08:05 Lane

He shamed me into doing it and and I got the book published and I thought, OK, my responsibility is over.

00:08:15 Lane

And then Kone says, well, now you have to put into practice like, oh, man, I don't want to do that.

00:08:23 Lane

And I was resistant to doing it until.

00:08:29 Lane

My dad.

00:08:31 Lane

Called me up one day and he told me he had cancer.

00:08:35 Lane

And of course, he wanted to fight it and everything.

00:08:38 Lane

So I was going with him to some of his appointments and.

00:08:42 Lane

And they determined that they wanted to do radiation treatment.

00:08:47 Lane

And they've made these marks on these. They'd in Sharpie on his body. These targets for the computer to, you know, aim the radiation at. And they told him Mr. Wilkins would like to tattoo these targets on you so that we don't have to do the measurements every time.

00:09:04 Lane

And that'll just free up your.

00:09:06 Lane

And you can spend more time with your family.

00:09:09 Lane

My dad had a really aggressive form of cancer called mesothelioma, and so they weren't even looking at saving him, so to speak, with just extending his life.

00:09:22 Lane

But he went home and he talked to me and said, you know.

00:09:27 Lane

They want to tattoo the radiation targets on me, but I don't want a man I don't know with a machine I don't know, touching my body. You've been studying tattooing for all these years.

00:09:37 Lane

You tattoo the targets on me.

00:09:42 Lane

I couldn't tell my dad no.

00:09:49 Lane

So we.

00:09:54 Lane

We set a day to do that.

00:09:57 Lane

I made a very simple tool.

00:10:00 Lane

With a wooden dowel and a lemon thorn and got some India ink. My brother John stretched the skin for me.

00:10:08 Lane

Then I hand tapped those tattoos on my dad.

00:10:14 Lane

Those were the first tattoos I had done, ever.

00:10:18 Lane

And.

00:10:20 Lane

My dad, he passed away a few months later and actually never got the radiation treatment.

00:10:29 Lane

Oh.

00:10:30 Lane

But I had told some friends about my experience with my father and.

00:10:38 Lane

My friends in the Filipino community in Northern California, they said, would you be willing to do it for us?

00:10:46 Lane

And I said, yeah, if it's if it's small, I guess I can do that.

00:10:52 Lane

How do I go about doing this though? You know I'm?

00:10:56 Lane

Catain radiation targets is one thing.

00:10:59 Lane

Cultural tattoos whole another thing.

00:11:04 Lane

My my mentor Keony.

00:11:08 Lane

He.

00:11:08 Lane

Well, you got to have players to do it.

00:11:11 Lane

And that was a big problem because.

00:11:16 Lane

Of.

00:11:17 Lane

Allow these traditions have been lost in the Philippines to the point that a lot of Filipinos don't know that tattooing was commonplace in the old days.

00:11:20

Mm.

00:11:28 Lane

But it was demonized as people, you know.

00:11:32 Lane

Converted to different religions and Christian religions, and so nowadays you know a lot of people still don't know, in spite of all the work that people you know, others, callers and myself have done, you know, it's still not very common knowledge.

00:11:49 Lane

And but anyway.

00:11:54 Lane

The original rituals in those places in the Philippines have been lost and so.

00:12:01 Lane

With Kenya encouraging me to do it to practice, but I needed to have prayers, I consulted with my mom and in my family my mom taught me the prayers that were taught to her by her mother.

00:12:15 Lane

That were for the purpose of doing autonomous, which is Athan in Ilocano, which is my mother's ethnic group in language.

00:12:24 Lane

Malatun is the person who does the autonomous, does the prayers to some of the ancestors, and that's done for a whole host of reasons.

00:12:32 Lane

Could be for.

00:12:35 Lane

Healing it could be for soul retrieval.

00:12:38 Lane

It could be to just to honor those that have passed.

00:12:44 Lane

She had taught me those prayers. So I'm the man that I'm of my family and with my mother.

00:12:50 Lane

Help we reworded.

00:12:52 Lane

We adapted our family's prayers to be more specific about for doing the doing our traditional tattoos.

00:13:00 Lane

As kind of a placeholder for when or if it's even possible for us to recover those original prayers which after 30 years of research, I'm pretty doubtful unless Electiveatic has it recorded somewhere.

00:13:13 Lane

Or, you know, some Jesuit priest or something.

00:13:16 Lane

It written down the manuscript somewhere.

00:13:19 Lane

But I'm not real hopeful about that, so.

00:13:23 Lane

Using our families pros to.

00:13:27 Lane

Invite the old ones to come and participate in the ceremony.

00:13:32 Lane

I I started tattooing a few of my friends and then word start spreading around. This was in 2013.

00:13:41 Lane

Word started, spread, getting spread around that. There was this guy who knew how.

00:13:44 Lane

Do a book.

00:13:47 Lane

And so people began asking me and referring their friends to me. And.

00:13:52 Lane

Before I knew it, people started calling me. I'm.

00:13:56 Lane

On the Batok is a.

00:14:02 Lane

That's very loaded.

00:14:06 Lane

Title. I don't know that I'm entirely worthy of that.

00:14:10 Lane

But I do my best to serve the community in that in that role.

00:14:15 Lane

The Mumbai is considered a healer as well as a tattooist.

00:14:23 Lane

There are spiritual guide.

00:14:25

Mm.

00:14:26 Lane

And.

00:14:28 Lane

The term bethulka Ilocano.

00:14:32 Lane

Two, but it also means to dive.

00:14:35 Lane

To dive down now, among the people who I have lineage to as well.

00:14:42 Lane

There's a ritual where a young man will dive into the.

00:14:45 Lane

And he will catch a fish in his bare hands, and he'll bring it up to the surface. And then he's declared the mamaboth of the diver.

00:14:54 Lane

Person who dives into the water now, this goes back to our this is symbolic of our our afterlife belief.

00:15:01 Merrily

Thank you.

00:15:03 Lane

In in the ancient Philippines, as well as in Polynesia and other parts of the Pacific, when you died, you went to the underworld of the dead and that's often thought to be across an impassable body of water.

00:15:17 Lane

Or beneath the ocean.

00:15:19 Lane

And this is the realm of the ancestors.

00:15:22 Lane

A. It's a figure of speech, really.

00:15:27 Lane

Excuse me.

00:15:30 Lane

It's a figure of speech, really.

00:15:36 Lane

The reason for it's a figure.

00:15:38 Lane

It's.

00:15:39 Lane

It's because it's a reference to our maritime traditions. In the old days, when you sail away from a land mass because of the curvature of the earth at the farther you sail away from it, it seems to sink into the horizon or go into the ocean figuratively it.

00:15:56 Lane

Into the underwor.

00:15:58 Lane

It's not unlike.

00:15:59 Lane

Like how Americans might describe Australia being as down under.

00:16:04 Merrily

Right.

00:16:05 Lane

It's not literally underneath us, it's on the other side of the planet.

00:16:10 Lane

And so.

00:16:12 Lane

Diving into the into the water and bringing back a fish and being declared the mamaboth of the in the Itna ritual.

00:16:21 Lane

It's symbolic of diving into the underworld of the dead and bringing back nourishment.

00:16:28 Lane

So that is one of the functions of the mamabato is to bring that nourishment to the living from the ancestors in the form of our tattoos.

00:16:41 Lane

And so.

00:16:43 Lane

Again, I I don't entirely feel worthy of.

00:16:46 Lane

You know be, you know, people call me a mammoth look, and I do.

00:16:51 Lane

I do do some healing work, I do.

00:16:56 Lane

My best to fulfill that responsibility.

00:16:58 Lane

But.

00:17:00 Lane

I don't.

00:17:01 Lane

The fully qualified for that.

00:17:07 Lane

And it's been, it's been a tremendous blessing in my life to assist our people in recovering their identities.

00:17:17 Lane

In recovering their identity as people of the Philippines and and being connected to the ancestors, one of the purposes of our tattoos is for us to have a strong relationship with those on the other side.

00:17:34 Lane

That's one of the main reasons for it.

00:17:37 Lane

It's a spiritual enhancement of sorts.

00:17:40

Mm.

00:17:41 Lane

And.

00:17:44 Lane

And that's one of the reasons why we have to have prayers when we do these tattoos because.

00:17:50 Lane

In our tradition, it is considered rude to talk about behind another person's back, and that even includes the dead.

00:17:56 Lane

So if you're going to be talking about your ancestors, there has to be.

00:17:56 Merrily

Right.

00:18:03 Lane

Some physical manifestation of.

00:18:05 Lane

You know something that represents them or they have to be summoned.

00:18:10 Lane

So that you as we tattoo this visual language on a person's body.

00:18:17 Lane

They are not being excluded from that conversation.

00:18:21 Lane

And so in the pros that I do, I I invite the old ones to come and participate in the in the tattooing as well as recognize the that we are doing because we are honoring them through this practice.

00:18:37 Lane

And.

00:18:38 Lane

The prayers as well as offerings to the dead are given at that time, before we can even begin tattooing. We have to do these prayers and we have to make these offerings so that they are appeased because a lot of these designs.

00:18:53 Lane

Are.

00:18:53 Lane

Stylized representations of ancestors, either in their human form, their or the physical manifestation like which might be a plant.

00:19:02 Lane

Could be a mountain, it could be a celestial body.

00:19:07 Lane

Any number of things that represent them physically.

00:19:12 Lane

It's not always explicit. It's sometimes implicit designs that didn't know an ancestor.

00:19:23 Lane

It's kind of my practice in a nutshell or how I got started anyways.

00:19:24 Merrily

Yes.

00:19:27 Lane

Yeah, I was a Mormon missionary.

00:19:29 Merrily

And here's the yeah, and here's the through line of how that happened.

00:19:34 Merrily

I love how he explained the actual the definition of the Mamba batok and then the diving, because when you're explaining it, it kind of.

00:19:43 Merrily

The the sort of.

00:19:44 Merrily

Similar image I was getting was when when people talk about.

00:19:49 Merrily

Michelangelo and he would do the statue, he would cart.

00:19:52 Merrily

Would.

00:19:52 Merrily

He would start with the block.

00:19:55 Merrily

Of marble or whatever. And he was like, they would say, well, how do?

00:19:59 Merrily

How do?

00:19:59 Merrily

How do you do?

00:20:00 Merrily

How do you get David out of?

00:20:01 Merrily

He was like, well, he was already in there. I just.

00:20:03 Merrily

It out. You know, he was already there.

00:20:06 Merrily

So when you were.

00:20:07 Merrily

Describing sort of diving and how.

00:20:09 Merrily

That was, you know, it's like the similar term is.

00:20:13 Merrily

I was like, oh, he was sort of like they're already there, and you're just bringing it to the surface, which I think is like a cool image.

00:20:20 Lane

Yeah, a lot of people have mentioned that to.

00:20:23 Lane

That it feels like after we get the work done, it feels like it's always been there or that I just brought it to the surface.

00:20:29 Merrily

Yeah.

00:20:33 Merrily

Yeah. So maybe, you know, maybe the title lurks.

00:20:34 Lane

I don't.

00:20:34 Lane

How you felt?

00:20:37 Merrily

The title seems to work for me.

00:20:41 Merrily

I get it, yeah.

00:20:42 Lane

Thank you.

00:20:44 Merrily

So kind of before we talk about 'cause, I did do it.

00:20:47 Merrily

Wanna talk about the ceremony itself? 'cause it.

00:20:49 Merrily

So cool.

00:20:51 Merrily

But what are some things that you wanted to dispel, if anything about Filipino cultural tattooing?

00:20:59 Lane

Well, there there's kind of the misunderstanding and some people have perpetuated this misunderstanding, unfortunately, and it might be due to their own ignorance that.

00:21:13 Lane

The means are secret that they cannot be revealed, that you can't share what the designs are with other people, otherwise it'll lose its power.

00:21:23 Lane

And that's not true.

00:21:25 Lane

You have to remember that in the old days this is a form of.

00:21:29 Lane

You know visual language.

00:21:32 Lane

And you could by looking at a person and seeing their designs, know what ethnic group they belong to, that you might. Then you need to know that because they might be a village.

00:21:43 Lane

Friendly to yours, it might be an enemy of yours.

00:21:45 Lane

You have to know the different.

00:21:47 Merrily

Right.

00:21:48 Lane

But it also denotes their rank and their position in in society.

00:21:53 Lane

So.

00:21:55 Lane

There are marks specifically for healers, for example, and you would know by their markings that this person had the capacity to help you, or if they were a high-ranking chief, you would recognize that or you would recognize that that person's a warrior and need know to.

00:22:11 Lane

Out of their path.

00:22:13 Lane

You know, to show deference to that person so.

00:22:17 Lane

It functioned in many different ways in our in our ancient society.

00:22:24 Lane

As well as was used for healing healing purposes.

00:22:29 Lane

That correlates with.

00:22:32 Lane

Acupuncture if you're. If you're familiar with acupuncture, it it is placed over specific parts of the body to enhance person's health.

00:22:42 Lane

If you compared the layout of our tattoos from what has been recorded in old manuscripts, like the designs that were recorded by Father Alsina Francisco Alcina.

00:22:58 Lane

Or the designs that are recorded in the Box Codex in the layout on the body, they correlate with the placement of those placements correlate with Meridian lines in the body.

00:23:12 Lane

And specific acupuncture points.

00:23:16 Lane

So when you tattoo over that place or that spot, you are permanently charging that with energy.

00:23:25 Lane

It's like wearing black clothing and going out.

00:23:27 Lane

The.

00:23:27 Lane

You you feel the heat from solar energy as it's absorbing it, and it's the same with a with a black tattoo.

00:23:35 Lane

It's absorbing solar energy into that specific spot.

00:23:40 Lane

And through my research, I've been able to realize that our ancestors did.

00:23:46 Lane

It's a very intentionally.

00:23:49 Lane

They were augmenting a person's health by tattooing them and my school.

00:23:58 Lane

Kathal living traditions and I we actually participated in a research study that shows the immunological benefits of being tattooed.

00:24:07 Lane

People with more tattoos have a stronger immune system.

00:24:12 Lane

But a lot of time people are doing this without that understanding.

00:24:20 Lane

And specific types of tattoos, different colours absorb different spectrums of light.

00:24:25 Lane

The the SIP based ink that we use.

00:24:29 Lane

Or indigenous inks are are made from from soot.

00:24:34 Lane

And that is what's considered light absorbing carbon it absorbs.

00:24:40 Lane

It absorbs a spectrum of light that is between 300 nanometers and 800 nanometers and that happens to be the beneficial frequencies of light, near infrared and near ultraviolet that are beneficial to our bodies.

00:24:55

Oh.

00:24:56 Lane

So.

00:24:58 Lane

I don't know that our ancestors understood, you know, 300 native.

00:25:03 Merrily

Right.

00:25:06 Lane

And and so it's. It's a very intentional practice that we do and I don't deviate from those traditional layouts because of that.

00:25:14

This.

00:25:21

Yeah.

00:25:22 Merrily

It was very.

00:25:23 Merrily

And I was telling you before.

00:25:26 Merrily

We chatted 'cause I had to e-mail.

00:25:27 Merrily

I was like, oh, this is what I kind of experienced in like the days following.

00:25:32 Merrily

The batok where I was like feeling there was a lot of flow and there was, you know, I had like dropped a bunch of weight all of a sudden which has not happened for me even though I've been intentionally trying to drop weight.

00:25:43 Merrily

So I was like, wow, there's all this flow.

00:25:45 Merrily

And then I went and saw my acupuncturist, and she was like, yeah, basically the lines where you got the tattoo is is flow and it is there to balance.

00:25:54

What?

00:25:57 Merrily

The the male energy with the female energy in your body and I.

00:26:00 Merrily

Like oh.

00:26:01 Merrily

My gosh. Well, there you go. Boom.

00:26:04 Merrily

Lines up.

00:26:07 Merrily

That was very cool.

00:26:08 Lane

Yeah.

00:26:11 Merrily

And so yeah, definitely.

00:26:12 Merrily

Definitely talk about the ceremony because basically when I do tell everybody I was like, yeah, I was there for 10 hours and they're like, what, 10 hour? Almost 10 hours?

00:26:23 Merrily

What? So if you don't?

00:26:25 Merrily

Kind of walking us through sort of the.

00:26:29 Merrily

I know like a lot of that is sort of discussion and chatting and getting to know each other and finding out, you know, so you can kind of get a picture of what to actually put on my body.

00:26:39 Merrily

But would you mind sort of?

00:26:40 Merrily

Us through that.

00:26:43 Lane

Yeah. So based on the person's specific ethnic group from the Philippines, there are certain designs and layouts on the body.

00:26:53 Lane

And you know, if you're like, like you, if you're what I, then there's kind of a palliative design that I could potentially choose from for that layer.

00:27:06 Lane

Out. But which of those designs is most pertinent to the individual? That's freshed out in our conversations.

00:27:14 Lane

Don't.

00:27:14 Lane

I don't have anything usually premeditated before I go into, I do meditate.

00:27:21 Lane

Before a person comes over, I do also prayers before a person comes over, and sometimes I get a general understanding of what might go there, but that doesn't really gel.

00:27:32 Merrily

Mm.

00:27:35 Lane

Till I have a conversation with the person.

00:27:39 Lane

And then the specific designs are shown to me, so to speak. And so the first little while is just asking to know each other in all of our rituals in the Philippines, there's feasting.

00:27:43

Right.

00:27:52 Lane

So we take time to eat.

00:27:54 Lane

We take time to drink a little.

00:27:56 Lane

Not alcohol, but just eat and drink a little bit and get to know each other a little better so that those things can gel for me.

00:28:04 Merrily

Mm.

00:28:05 Lane

None.

00:28:06 Lane

Then, once that happens, once I have a good idea of what designs need to be there and who needs to be represented. Sometimes it's a deity, sometimes it's an ancestor.

00:28:19 Lane

Then I draw the designs on the.

00:28:22 Lane

'S body.

00:28:24 Lane

And that's when I explain all the designs.

00:28:28 Lane

I explain what they mean.

00:28:30 Lane

What they symbolize, what their names are.

00:28:33 Lane

And some of the designs are mnemonic devices to remember oral history.

00:28:38 Lane

So if you have a lightning pattern, there's a deity that's attached to it, or multiple deities depending on, you know where you're from.

00:28:48 Lane

And there are often stories that go along with those.

00:28:51 Lane

So if I wanted to do my due diligence and I and.

00:28:59 Lane

And do this practice in a in a good way. I need to make sure that the person understands those designs mean and represent so that they are literate in their own markings. Part of our purpose.

00:29:13 Lane

With living traditions is to help our people become literate again in our markings so that we can read them again so that we can recognize each other again.

00:29:24 Lane

And so I would be doing the recipient a disservice by not telling them what they have.

00:29:31 Lane

Then it's just pretty designed so.

00:29:36 Lane

I have to explain all of that to a person, and sometimes those explanations can take a long time.

00:29:44 Lane

I think you and I, we spent at least an hour.

00:29:49 Lane

Or of explanation.

00:29:52 Merrily

Yeah.

00:29:53

And.

00:29:58 Lane

But.

00:30:00 Lane

Then it has to resonate with the individual.

00:30:03 Lane

It needs to feel like it belongs up at that point. Then we move forward, the ritual stuff, and that's when we do the prayers and the offerings to the old ones. And we do a few other prayers too.

00:30:17 Lane

If the design.

00:30:19 Lane

Is for a specific day.

00:30:21 Lane

Then we invoke that deity before we tattoo.

00:30:26 Lane

Again, we don't want to talk, so to speak, behind their back.

00:30:30 Lane

So if I remember correctly at the at the beginning of your tattooing, I invoked moon deity so.

00:30:38 Merrily

Yes.

00:30:40 Lane

He would be present while we tattooed the moon patterns on your body.

00:30:45 Lane

So.

00:30:47 Lane

During those prayers, of course, we want to keep it.

00:30:51 Lane

We want to keep it respectful to the spirits that we're inviting and but once those prayers are done and the tapping begins.

00:31:02 Lane

Then.

00:31:03 Lane

The mood is allowed to be lighter, and that's what we call luluah.

00:31:10 Lane

It it means to.

00:31:11 Lane

To entertain, distract, but also to comfort or to console a person.

00:31:19 Lane

All of the above.

00:31:20 Lane

There's no translation into English, but the mood's allowed to be lighter and.

00:31:28 Lane

We want the person to get through the experience the best that they can so we can joke around a little bit, you know and.

00:31:36 Lane

I've had people come and play music for us while we were, you know, with indigenous instruments.

00:31:42 Lane

Or, you know, whatever we need to do to help the person navigate the pain.

00:31:47 Lane

Some people have a very high pain tolerance, some people don't.

00:31:51

Replay.

00:31:51 Lane

It's usually the males.

00:31:53 Merrily

Right, yeah.

00:31:55 Lane

But.

00:31:57 Lane

Yeah, they score a lot more, but.

00:32:02 Lane

Yeah. Then we we do the work and.

00:32:07 Lane

I mean, if you want to show about how that was for you.

00:32:12 Merrily

Yeah. Oh, gosh. Yeah. Like it, like I said, the beginning you and your apprentices are just so much fun. And I know in.

00:32:22 Merrily

People might not know this if they have either gone to a Filipino party or have like hung out with a bunch of Filipinos. We do like to joke around and make and light hearted jokes sometimes.

00:32:32 Merrily

Know, depending on which kind of Filipinos you get to, they can be a little more.

00:32:37 Merrily

Cutting. But that was not my experience with you guys.

00:32:39 Merrily

Were just a lot of fun.

00:32:41 Merrily

So yeah, I enjoyed that quite a bit 'cause I was like, I remember this when we were growing.

00:32:46 Merrily

My mom would have her Filipino friends over and it would just be a lot of laughing and a lot of like.

00:32:52 Merrily

Singing and you know, just, you know, learning about each other. And yeah, I was like, oh, this is it reminded me a lot of that. And so it was really special.

00:33:01 Merrily

But yeah, and I liked.

00:33:02 Merrily

You know, we we played some.

00:33:04 Merrily

We talked a lot about music 'cause. That's like, so huge a part of my life.

00:33:08 Merrily

So I really appreciated that.

00:33:11 Merrily

But yeah, it definitely I did not feel I have. You know, if you guys wanna see my Instagram post.

00:33:17 Merrily

I have pictures of the tattoo that lane gave me and like talked all about it.

00:33:22 Merrily

But yeah, I.

00:33:24 Merrily

It didn't hurt at all if I if I could, I would have fallen asleep.

00:33:31 Merrily

But you know, it is like, you know, physically draining for you. And it is, even though it didn't hurt, it was still physically draining for me too. 'cause you have like 3 people pressing and stretching the skin.

00:33:43 Merrily

Which is really funny to me. 'cause I was showing my sister my arm.

00:33:46 Merrily

Was like, Oh yeah, there's all this, like bruising.

00:33:50 Merrily

Because and it wasn't from the tattoos, it was from the stretching right stretching of the skin.

00:33:55 Lane

Yeah.

00:33:56 Lane

They're very.

00:33:56 Merrily

But they're very strong.

00:33:57 Lane

My my students are very strong.

00:33:59 Merrily

They're very strong.

00:34:02 Merrily

But yeah, it was just so much.

00:34:04 Merrily

And then another thing that I you know 'cause you mentioned like drinking and we drank a lot of cava which.

00:34:12 Merrily

I I had told you guys that I literally had cava a couple weeks prior. 'cause, my friend, and we went to Australia.

00:34:18 Merrily

Was like we need to drink cava, but we totally did it the absolute wrong way.

00:34:24 Merrily

And basically, drink dirt is essentially what we did.

00:34:28 Merrily

So I did want to talk a little bit about Kava. Maybe folks aren't aware of it.

00:34:33 Merrily

What is?

00:34:35 Merrily

What is it?

00:34:36 Merrily

Why do we drink Kava when we're doing the batok?

00:34:39 Lane

OK.

00:34:42 Lane

So I was trained by Polynesians.

00:34:46 Lane

There was no one to teach me how to make the ancient tattooing implements of the Philippines that have been found in excavations.

00:34:58 Lane

And that that skill set has lost.

00:35:03

Hmm.

00:35:03 Lane

Now, there are still people that, that tattoo in the Philippines still there's some ethnic groups there, but these most ancient tools that skill set has been lost through colonization.

00:35:15 Lane

And so the Polynesians who recognize that we were related and this would be the Suluate family of Somali.

00:35:25 Lane

They had taken it upon themselves to reintroduce the the skill set and the technology to tattoo to the cousins.

00:35:35 Lane

And that included the.

00:35:37 Lane

And I was very fortunate to be taught.

00:35:41 Lane

So the tools that we use.

00:35:44 Lane

Are made out of wood and bone.

00:35:48 Lane

Different types of bone for different characteristics that are to be bequeathed to the individual. So.

00:35:56 Lane

For example, an albatross swing bone is one of the the implements that I used on you.

00:36:01 Lane

It's to give the person the ability to be like the albatross, to fly long, long distances with and and not require the rest.

00:36:12 Lane

So things like that.

00:36:15 Lane

But the skill set to create these columns of teeth or or needles out of a single bone.

00:36:23 Lane

That that's something that I had to be taught.

00:36:26 Lane

And and I'm very grateful to the Silawape family.

00:36:32 Lane

And especially to my teacher kyonay for teaching me how to do this so that our people could have it again.

00:36:39 Lane

So our people could experience what our ancestors experienced and so out of respect for my teachers.

00:36:48 Lane

Out of respect for the culture that they come from and they include Kava in their ceremonies.

00:36:55 Lane

Cover for those of you that may not know, is the root of the type of pepper plant which is related to black pepper, not chilies, black pepper.

00:37:04 Lane

And the root is ground up and made into a type of tea called steeped and then rung out of the bag.

00:37:14 Lane

That's the mistake that your friends and you made.

00:37:16

Yep.

00:37:17 Lane

That you just want to mix it.

00:37:19 Lane

Water it's it's. It has to be in a bag so you don't bring.

00:37:22

Yep, let's.

00:37:25

Yep.

00:37:27 Lane

But but the.

00:37:30 Lane

The cover is a natural anti-inflammatory in the muscle relaxant and a mild analgesic, so it pairs very well with tattooing and according to what I was told and taught, the deities or ancestors that govern.

00:37:47 Lane

Are also the deities that govern cover.

00:37:51 Lane

And so out of respect for them, we drink Kava in my school.

00:37:56 Lane

I'm also adopted into Hawaiian family, so I'd also drink it out of respect for my my family.

00:38:03 Lane

But Kava is also found in the Philippines. Although it's not you ceremonially anymore in the Philippines, there are a few terms for it.

00:38:13 Lane

Biele Biele or Kuo or Kuiot or kolot.

00:38:19 Lane

But it's no longer used ceremonially, and we do have the same deities under slightly different names in the Philippines as well.

00:38:28 Lane

So it's not too big of a jump for us to include it in our ceremonies, but I'm transparent with people that we don't know that Cava was part of our.

00:38:38 Lane

Ancient ceremonies of tattooing, but in my school out of respect for the lineage of my tools that come from Osama's.

00:38:47 Lane

We drink club out of respect for them and for our mutual ancestors.

00:38:53 Lane

So yeah, we we drove quite a.

00:38:54 Lane

Of cover while you were there.

00:38:55 Merrily

Yeah, I think I was like, I think it's like 5 at least five times for sure. We like did at least 5 rounds, if not more.

00:39:06 Merrily

When my sister I asked my.

00:39:07 Merrily

I was like, how many times did you?

00:39:09 Merrily

Was like I think she.

00:39:10 Merrily

Only maybe once or twice. I was like, we did a lot.

00:39:12 Merrily

Was like bring it on.

00:39:19 Merrily

Very cool.

00:39:20 Lane

Yeah, it's great.

00:39:22 Lane

It the the person is, the more relax their skin is and the and I don't have to tap as hard.

00:39:29 Merrily

Yeah.

00:39:30 Lane

So you know that that might be why your skin was so receptive and it wasn't as painful for you, yeah.

00:39:38 Merrily

Sure. And then the other thing too that I I did want to mention like I I had told you when we were as we were talking sort of throughout the night that I do have other machine tattoos and a couple of them I got and I didn't really.

00:39:52 Merrily

The person who tattooed them on me and a couple of that I did get.

00:39:56 Merrily

Was like I really enjoyed the person that did it.

00:40:00 Merrily

And so I said.

00:40:02 Merrily

I wish every time you get a tattoo that you can like have this like length of time to sit with the people and really get to know them and so that you feel like they actually care about you and aren't just like trying to get you done and.

00:40:14 Merrily

You out the door.

00:40:16 Merrily

That's not your process at all.

00:40:17 Lane

Right.

00:40:18 Merrily

Yeah. So I love that.

00:40:19

Yeah.

00:40:23 Lane

Yeah, it's, it's it's a huge responsibility for us to adorn people with with the Pope. And there's a relationship that happens there.

00:40:30

Mm.

00:40:34 Lane

Is an exchange that happens there energetically.

00:40:38 Lane

That's something that my my teacher taught me about is that we have we're there's an exchange that happens there energetically and and we have to be respectful of that. And some of our exchanges just get to know the individual too.

00:40:53 Lane

No, we you come in as a recipient, you leave as a friend.

00:40:58 Merrily

Yeah, yeah, that's definitely how it felt for sure, which is great.

00:41:03 Merrily

And so I have another thing that I was explaining to people was, well, the main thing was I remember you're tapping and you were talking to somebody who wasn't in the room, but I could see at least. And you kept mentioning like, oh, no, you're having a convers.

00:41:20 Merrily

Somebody. And so when we took a break, I was like.

00:41:22 Merrily

Hey man. Only like, who are you talking to exactly?

00:41:25 Merrily

You were dressing.

00:41:26 Merrily

Oh, so I wasn't sure if it was your oppo.

00:41:28 Merrily

My Hubble.

00:41:31 Merrily

But yeah, it was like very interesting that there's, like, spiritual spirit contact during this earthquake or it can happen.

00:41:39 Lane

Oh yeah, it's it's not.

00:41:41 Lane

Not.

00:41:42 Lane

I'm I'm not trying to make it not special or anything like that, but it's not uncommon for that to happen, especially when a person is loved by those on the other side.

00:41:45 Merrily

Yeah.

00:41:52 Lane

Side they end up showing up and I realize this the first time I I did actual cultural tattooing after my father.

00:42:04 Lane

This woman that I was working on, she was a a philanthrop.

00:42:11 Lane

Ist from the culture. Didn't know anything really, especially about ancient culture I would.

00:42:18 Lane

So, but she started having kind of a waking vision while I was tapping her. And she said, I, I see this, this elder man, and he's dressed in red and he's got this red.

00:42:25

Mm.

00:42:32 Lane

Don't know what it is, but it's like a turban kind of thing that he has on his head. And I knew exactly what she was describing.

00:42:39 Lane

She was describing the attire of a chief.

00:42:44 Lane

And and I and I thought it was kind of an epiphany.

00:42:47 Lane

Like holy crap.

00:42:48 Lane

I summoned them and they came.

00:42:50 Merrily

Right. Wow, yeah.

00:42:51

And.

00:42:54 Lane

You know, over the years.

00:42:57 Lane

That I've been.

00:42:59 Lane

We we have quite a few experiences where.

00:43:03 Lane

All of a sudden, the room will feel crowded.

00:43:06 Lane

I think what really felt hot in the room.

00:43:10 Lane

What? There were too many people and there was just my two apprentices and I and you and I just felt like I felt like also like when I was having that conversation, it felt like someone.

00:43:16

Yeah.

00:43:22 Lane

Hovering over my shoulder like and and asking me to do something on like I can't do that this time.

00:43:28 Lane

I I I need.

00:43:29 Lane

I need to wrap this up kind of thing, but you had a you had a you had an ancestor that was like wanting more.

00:43:37 Merrily

Right, yeah.

00:43:40 Merrily

Not saying that, that's my family, but that's my family.

00:43:43 Lane

Yeah, that's her family.

00:43:45

Too, buddy.

00:43:47 Merrily

Oh my gosh.

00:43:47 Lane

Other times.

00:43:48 Lane

Other times we'll be like a perfume that'll come into the space.

00:43:54 Lane

And.

00:43:56 Lane

I'll, I'll say you know, do you smell that?

00:43:57 Lane

Know and the recipe will go, yeah.

00:44:00 Lane

And then like, it smells like roses or something, and they'll start crying like this.

00:44:06 Lane

Grandmother's perfume.

00:44:07 Merrily

Oh wow, yeah.

00:44:09 Lane

Had had another experience where there was a person from Iloilo down South and.

00:44:18 Lane

They I started smelling roasted fish.

00:44:23 Lane

And it's a particular dish I don't even remember the name of it. But I said, do you smell roasted fish?

00:44:27 Lane

She's and she starts getting kind of weepy, and she goes. That's that's my uncle who passed away.

00:44:32 Lane

Was.

00:44:33 Lane

She named the dish and it was boiled fish.

00:44:35 Lane

Hmm.

00:44:39 Lane

And so he was present, you know.

00:44:42 Lane

Other times, you know, with with deities in particular.

00:44:49 Lane

There sometimes wind spirits, and if we're putting their designs on the person, there will be a random wind that'll blow through the area.

00:45:01 Lane

To let us know that they're present.

00:45:05 Lane

So. So it's not just.

00:45:06 Lane

Not just.

00:45:08 Lane

You know.

00:45:10 Lane

Coincidences, I mean, it's happened so many times that we can't chalk it up to coincidence or anything like that.

00:45:18 Lane

It's the presence of those that are unseen.

00:45:21 Lane

And so that's why, you know, this is that's one of the biggest differences between.

00:45:27 Lane

Modern tattooing or or or, you know, Western tattooing if you want to call it that and doing indigenous practices is that this is a ritual and even though we have fun and that we can joke around and have.

00:45:43 Lane

A.

00:45:45 Lane

It's still a ritual.

00:45:46 Lane

It's still a spiritual experience.

00:45:49 Merrily

Yeah.

00:45:51 Merrily

I did have a question about sort of this being sensitive to spirit communication.

00:45:56 Merrily

That something you've always had or was it?

00:45:59 Merrily

It became more apparent when you started doing the batok.

00:46:02

Yeah.

00:46:05 Lane

Interestingly enough, although my I would say my my ability comes from my mom side and my grandmother etcetera.

00:46:18 Lane

The person who taught me to be aware of it was my father.

00:46:21

202.

00:46:23 Lane

Then it was actually in.

00:46:24 Lane

He was like he noticed that I got chills for no reason, he said.

00:46:30 Lane

Are you feeling?

00:46:30 Lane

I said I gotta chill for no reason.

00:46:32 Lane

Think it was like 12.

00:46:35 Lane

And he says.

00:46:37 Lane

You know that's that's the Holy Spirit speaking to you like. Oh, yeah and.

00:46:43

Mm.

00:46:45 Lane

No, I am.

00:46:47 Lane

No longer a practicing Mormon or anything like that.

00:46:49 Lane

Know.

00:46:51 Lane

I'm a.

00:46:51 Lane

I'm a pretty far removed now but.

00:46:55 Lane

Understanding when I had a spiritual experience that was really important in my in my development, I would say because it taught me to be aware and that is actually one of the traditional signs of a spirit is present in our traditions in the Philippines is is it will.

00:47:13 Lane

Cold for no reason, or you'll have a chill for no reason.

00:47:16 Lane

It's one of the signs that a spirit is present.

00:47:19

Yes.

00:47:19 Lane

And so after a while, just recognizing that my my father says now.

00:47:24

Repl.

00:47:27 Lane

When, when that happens, what you need to do is what is going through your head or your heart at the time.

00:47:34 Lane

Are you thinking about or what is happening around you so?

00:47:39 Lane

He he kind of compare it to the chill, using the chill as an example.

00:47:44 Lane

As the phone ringing and but it's up to me to pick up the phone.

00:47:50 Merrily

Right.

00:47:51 Lane

And realise what has been communicated and so that's something that I I developed initially as a Mormon. But then, you know, tattooing is a sin.

00:48:03 Lane

So.

00:48:05 Merrily

Yeah.

00:48:05 Lane

I was really surprised when I was starting tattooing and I was having chills for no reason.

00:48:11 Lane

Like OK, having a spiritual experience even though I'm doing something that's technically a sin I.

00:48:19 Lane

What's going on here?

00:48:20 Merrily

Yeah.

00:48:21 Lane

But again, you know, when I when I would have those experiences, the what I was supposed to do is still my heart and my mind and allow whatever communication to happen that needs to happen to happen.

00:48:35 Lane

And it's kind of like.

00:48:38 Lane

When you get a phone call and there's no caller ID and you pick up the phone and it's like.

00:48:44 Lane

Hey, Lane, how's it going?

00:48:46 Lane

You know, that was so dope the other day.

00:48:48 Lane

And you're like I.

00:48:49 Lane

Know who this is exactly. This. And you're just like. Yeah, bro. That was cool, dude.

00:48:56

Yes.

00:48:58 Lane

Fishing for like who is this person?

00:49:00 Merrily

Yes.

00:49:01 Lane

But as you become more and more familiar with that voice you like, oh, that's so. And so, you know, and pretty soon you don't need to to have them identify themselves. You just recognize their tone or you recognize the the feeling.

00:49:14 Lane

That they give off.

00:49:16 Merrily

Mm.

00:49:17 Lane

So you start recognizing specific spirits specific individuals.

00:49:21 Merrily

Yeah.

00:49:23 Lane

And so that's how you know, I kind of developed my special sensitivity and and you know the mode that you communicate with them, the more they want to communicate with you.

00:49:33 Merrily

Mm.

00:49:33 Lane

Out of all the descendants, that ancestor might have, how many people are paying attention?

00:49:41 Lane

Right, no.

00:49:44 Lane

Very few people pay attention, and especially in Western culture, I would say we're taught to ignore it.

00:49:50 Lane

No, we're, you know, the rational mind over rules, everything.

00:49:51

Mm.

00:49:54 Lane

I'm not.

00:49:55 Lane

That we shouldn't use our our rational mind.

00:49:59

Mm.

00:49:59 Lane

But the intuitive mind is also.

00:50:01 Lane

It's just as important and, in my opinion, probably more important.

00:50:03

Yeah.

00:50:07 Merrily

Yeah.

00:50:08 Lane

We didn't have to Google back in the day.

00:50:12 Lane

If you wanted to learn something, you asked your elders in the.

00:50:16 Lane

And if they didn't have an answer, then you appealed to those who had gone beyond.

00:50:21 Lane

That was the Google.

00:50:24 Lane

You're tapping into a lineage of of wisdom and knowledge that far exceeds your own.

00:50:31 Lane

And then I've had experiences with that too.

00:50:35 Lane

There are times.

00:50:37 Lane

One particular example I'll give is when.

00:50:41 Lane

I was trying to figure out how to make the the kissy or the tattooing tools of the Kalinga people that was made out of.

00:50:50 Lane

A carburetor ball for those of you that may not know, is a water Buffalo that we have in the Philippines and they would take a piece of parabella horn and they would bend it at a right angle and attach the needles to it, perpendicular to the handle and.

00:51:05 Lane

The tattooing implement that.

00:51:10 Lane

Now the last person that I know of that had the ability to make those types of tools died in 2001 and.

00:51:22 Lane

They're not made anymore.

00:51:23 Lane

The type of GC or KC that's made out of the carbide horn is they're not found anymore.

00:51:30 Lane

And I really was kind of down to try and figure out how that was made. And it wasn't until I was.

00:51:38 Lane

In a still place you know when my mind was quiet that I had made several. I had attempted several times to to bend the horn.

00:51:49 Lane

And all failing would broke a whole bunch of blanks trying to do it.

00:51:55 Lane

Then one day, when my mind was still thought comes into my head.

00:51:59 Lane

Need to soak it overnight in water.

00:52:01

Hmm.

00:52:02 Lane

Oh, OK, have the chill.

00:52:05

Got.

00:52:05

Yeah.

00:52:05 Lane

That fight went into my.

00:52:07 Lane

You know, OK, I I'll, I'll soak it overnight in water and I have been trying to fire bend it, but I hadn't soaked it overnight.

00:52:15

Right here.

00:52:16 Lane

Anyway.

00:52:18 Lane

The next day I pulled it out of the bucket I had submerged it in and and I won't tell you my whole process.

00:52:25 Lane

Proprietary knowledge, but the next day I was able to bend it to that right angle.

00:52:29 Merrily

Wow.

00:52:32 Lane

And so very specific types of knowledge can be given to a person you know from that other side they.

00:52:41 Lane

They want.

00:52:41 Lane

They want to show their their knowledge with you, but again, how many of us are listening?

00:52:47 Merrily

Yeah, exactly.

00:52:51 Lane

One of one of the other experiences I'll I'll share briefly is when I was this was in 2001, I was still doing the research for Filipino tattoos ancient to modern and I had reached kind of an impasse in my research.

00:53:08 Lane

Could.

00:53:09 Lane

I had designs.

00:53:11 Lane

But I didn't know the names of the designs.

00:53:14 Lane

Didn't.

00:53:16 Lane

I just found that.

00:53:21 Lane

Lose patterns and.

00:53:24 Lane

I was really.

00:53:26 Lane

I couldn't couldn't figure out how to how to get get anymore knowledge about them and I went to bed one night.

00:53:31 Lane

I.

00:53:31 Lane

A dream. And in this dream, this old man wearing a white linen cloth like mahog.

00:53:39 Lane

He's standing in the middle of the the forest and he kind of beckoned to me to follow him. So he I followed him through the forest and he got to this big banyan tree that was cut down.

00:53:50 Lane

And he had me lean up against it.

00:53:53 Lane

Sit.

00:53:53 Lane

Lean up my back against it, which you know is very symbolic if you know our traditions around Baltimore but he.

00:54:05 Lane

Grabbed my arm, pulled it towards him and there were all these tattoos on my arm and he started explaining all the designs and meanings.

00:54:16 Lane

And it was such a vivid.

00:54:18 Lane

I woke up from it and I I wrote the dream down.

00:54:22 Lane

The next night went to sleep.

00:54:23 Lane

Thing.

00:54:24 Lane

The same exact dream happened where he explained all the designs to me.

00:54:28 Lane

And you know, I I woke up from that dream and I I'm like, wow, that was really powerful.

00:54:35 Lane

But as time went on, you know, throughout the day I thought, well, what if this is just my subconscious trying to figure out a way around this impasse in my research?

00:54:43 Lane

Know.

00:54:43 Lane

If this is just me trying to.

00:54:45 Lane

Know.

00:54:47 Lane

Figure it out.

00:54:49 Lane

Well, that night I went to bed.

00:54:53 Lane

And had another dream.

00:54:54 Lane

And the old man was it was there in my apartment, at the foot of my bed, this old lackey.

00:55:03 Lane

And he was mad.

00:55:06 Merrily

At me and he pulled me out of.

00:55:07 Lane

The bed put.

00:55:08 Lane

Me to the mirror in the bathroom and said.

00:55:11 Lane

Keep keep that bum. Look at your face.

00:55:16 Lane

And I looked in the mirror and all the tattoos were on my face. Now and then he went through the lesson again and.

00:55:21

Wow.

00:55:23 Lane

I woke up from that dream like, OK up or OK. Grandfather, I I I know this isn't my.

00:55:29 Lane

Now I know that you're trying to communicate with me, but who in their right mind is going to say, you know, when I write this scholarly book?

00:55:36 Lane

By the way, this is what this design means, because I had a dream about everything to laugh at me.

00:55:41 Lane

But it but because he had identified the designs to me, it gave me a direction to research.

00:55:48 Lane

And about six months later, I found the documentation for everything he had explained.

00:55:54 Lane

And.

00:55:55 Lane

And so I was.

00:55:55 Merrily

Amazing, yeah.

00:55:56 Lane

So that's one of my my secrets to now out in the public. I guess when the secrets to my research for Filipino tattoos, agent Tamana, is that some of the knowledge was given beforehand.

00:56:04

Yeah.

00:56:10 Merrily

Yeah.

00:56:11 Lane

And I just had to go find the proof.

00:56:13 Merrily

Yeah.

00:56:15 Merrily

That's amazing.

00:56:16 Merrily

Yeah, it is interesting the way that we're taught, at least in the West, is to question well why it's so terrible in a lot of ways. It's like to question the feelings in your body and to question like, these things that happen to you.

00:56:28 Merrily

Like but that's you know that it's not a dream, you know that.

00:56:31 Merrily

Know what I?

00:56:32 Merrily

You're like I know.

00:56:33 Merrily

I know how my dreams work, you know.

00:56:35 Merrily

So I think it's really special that you could look at it and then use it.

00:56:40 Merrily

Know it was an aid to your research.

00:56:43 Merrily

Which I think is really something as far as like not to.

00:56:50 Merrily

To kind of fix all the wrongs of colonialism, I do think that a lot of that is going to come from these, that communication that every everybody around the world who has suffered from it, I think.

00:57:02 Merrily

Getting that back in touch with the ancestors to figure out, like, where all that lost information can be resurfaced again.

00:57:09 Merrily

I think that's such a cool example.

00:57:11 Merrily

Like gets me jazzed up.

00:57:14

Well, I.

00:57:15 Lane

I really hope that people lean into it more and.

00:57:18 Merrily

Yeah.

00:57:20 Lane

Even even those that were considered colonizers, you know, long ago they were colonized themselves and and come from indigenous traditions that couldn't be recovered.

00:57:24 Merrily

Yeah.

00:57:27 Merrily

Sadly.

00:57:32 Lane

There's wisdom there, you know, just because.

00:57:34 Lane

You know, we'd like to think of ourselves as the most technologically advanced, the most advanced humans that ever existed.

00:57:43 Lane

People were not stupid. For thousands and thousands of years.

00:57:47

Right.

00:57:48 Lane

There's a wealth of knowledge there, you know.

00:57:50 Merrily

Yes.

00:57:51 Lane

We just have to tap into it, no pun intended.

00:57:54 Merrily

But yeah, pun intended. Come on, yeah.

00:57:57

OK.

00:57:58 Merrily

Oh my God.

00:58:03 Merrily

Oh my goodness.

00:58:05 Merrily

Yeah, I think.

00:58:06 Merrily

Definitely.

00:58:07 Merrily

I I want more of that for our future and you know, like you said, it's been around for that. If they weren't doing what they were doing for thousands of years, we wouldn't be here, yo.

00:58:17 Merrily

So, like think about that.

00:58:20 Lane

Exactly.

00:58:20

Yeah.

00:58:22 Merrily

So kind of wrapping up here, but I I wonder if you do have some ways for folks, whether they're Filipino or not, maybe.

00:58:31 Merrily

But they can start having their own connection to their ancestors.

00:58:36 Merrily

Is something that you would recommend?

00:58:39 Lane

Well, first, first and foremost I would say is is establish a relationship with your elders that you have now.

00:58:48 Lane

Now, whether that's your parents, grandparents, and if you're fortunate to know your great grandparents, get to know your elders.

00:58:56 Lane

And pick their brains.

00:59:00 Lane

Get to know them.

00:59:01 Lane

You know how how? How is it for?

00:59:04 Lane

How how are you going to have a relationship with those that are ancient if you can't have a relationship with those that are here?

00:59:11 Merrily

Right.

00:59:12 Lane

So I would encourage everyone to.

00:59:15 Lane

To tap into what you have in front of your face right now and then also work on your your spiritual life.

00:59:25 Lane

You know, whatever that looks like you know.

00:59:30 Lane

Spiritual sensitivity.

00:59:32 Lane

You know, so that you can recognize the voices when they when they call.

00:59:36

Yeah.

00:59:38 Lane

In our traditions, you you didn't want to go around and have a relationship with randos you know with random spirits, you wanted to have a relationship with those that were from your lineage, from your family.

00:59:52

Right.

00:59:52 Lane

Those are the ones that have a vested interest in your.

00:59:56 Lane

The random spirit or or the deity may not. They may not have your interest at heart.

01:00:03 Lane

They might be.

01:00:04 Lane

They might want, you know, sacrifices or or you jump through certain hoops, whereas your family loves you.

01:00:10 Merrily

Yeah.

01:00:11 Lane

And they care about you as long as you show them the respect.

01:00:15 Lane

Again, it's like it's like your grandparents.

01:00:17 Lane

Know you when we when.

01:00:20 Lane

You know are in front of our grandparents.

01:00:22 Lane

You know, we want to treat them with a certain amount of deference and respect, and if you can't do that in this life, how can you deal with those that are beyond so, you know, having those types of relationships they in our in our belief system, if you.

01:00:37 Lane

Care of.

01:00:37 Lane

That relationship should be going to lose their relationship.

01:00:40 Merrily

Right.

01:00:41 Lane

If you have a relationship with a with the ancestors, for example.

01:00:47 Lane

And you don't maintain the relationship, you're going to lose the relationship.

01:00:51 Lane

So the first thing is to establish the relationship.

01:00:55 Lane

And then recognize when they're calling, so to speak, and then have the courage to act on it.

01:01:03 Lane

Have the courage to act on their wisdom.

01:01:07 Lane

If I had, you know when I had those thoughts planted in my head about how to bend the curve or to make the kissy.

01:01:17 Lane

If I didn't act on that, I would have never known and never had the confirmation that it was communication from the other.

01:01:24 Lane

So you find out whether or not it's actual communication or not by the repercussions of what they ask you to do or what they're teaching you.

01:01:34 Lane

If it, if it turns out to be something bad.

01:01:40 Lane

Maybe it wasn't, you know?

01:01:41 Lane

Or maybe it wasn't the right person, you know?

01:01:45 Lane

Get to know them as individuals.

01:01:48 Lane

Not just as some vague.

01:01:50 Lane

Abolition or entity? You know, get to know them as individuals.

01:01:52

Mm.

01:01:57 Lane

But that's what I would encourage, and regardless of your ethnolinguistic background.

01:02:02 Lane

You know whether you're from the Philippines or other places, you know, everybody has ancestors, everybody has traditions that go with those ancestors, you know, due to due diligence and explore that.

01:02:14 Lane

You know.

01:02:16 Lane

Don't appropriate somebody else's practice just because that's available.

01:02:20 Merrily

Mm.

01:02:21 Lane

It's so rewarding to find your own, to find your own traditions.

01:02:28 Lane

That's one of the the pitfalls that I see with some Filipino Americans is that yes, we are related to Polynesians, but we are not the not quite the same. You know they have their own nuances.

01:02:42 Lane

Same goes with native people that are a little more distant.

01:02:45 Lane

They did, you know, lot of.

01:02:49 Lane

A lot of Filipinos end up adopting native practices, and that's not that's not certainly not appropriate.

01:02:55

Mm.

01:02:56 Lane

We have commonalities. We have similarities and it might resonate with us.

01:03:00 Lane

But find out why it resonates with you, you know, and then dive into your own background and see what your people have to offer.

01:03:10 Lane

If you if you want to get.

01:03:11 Lane

For example.

01:03:15 Lane

I won't mention their names, but I've had people you know, come to me and say, hey, I want Filipino tattoos and I'm like, well, there are circumstances in which we can do that. If you're not Filipino.

01:03:26

Mm.

01:03:27 Lane

But you have to be part of our.

01:03:29 Lane

You have to participate in our community to receive those markings.

01:03:34 Lane

If you're not, then what I do is I encourage people to to dive into their own background and find their own ancestral markings.

01:03:41 Lane

From what I've found in my own research is that.

01:03:44 Lane

Most cultures throughout the world had some form of body adornment or modification.

01:03:50 Lane

It just needs to be recovered and and.

01:03:52 Lane

Woken back back.

01:03:53 Lane

Back up.

01:03:54 Lane

I might have been asleep for a long time, but you can.

01:03:57 Lane

It back up.

01:03:58

Well.

01:04:00 Merrily

Ah, that's great advice.

01:04:04 Merrily

All right, So what are I usually? Also my second closing thing is what are some projects or events that you have coming up, if any that you want to know about?

01:04:17 Lane

Um.

01:04:18 Lane

Let's see.

01:04:22 Lane

Well, I am writing an article for a.

01:04:26 Lane

Magazine.

01:04:29 Lane

I can't divulge to the public what magazine that is, but it's a prominent magazine.

01:04:36 Merrily

Nice, nice.

01:04:40 Lane

That'll be coming out in the future in the the next few months.

01:04:45 Lane

But I am low key working on writing another book.

01:04:50 Lane

Well, it's about time.

01:04:52 Lane

It's about time for me to do that and.

01:04:56 Lane

And I'll.

01:04:57 Lane

Doing some more lectures throughout the year.

01:05:01 Lane

At various places.

01:05:03 Lane

Can be doing the the soonest 1 is.

01:05:06 Lane

Maybe.

01:05:06 Lane

A lecture workshop series over on the Isle of Koai in Hawaii in February.

01:05:14 Lane

So I got that coming up and.

01:05:18 Lane

Yeah, if you want to. If you want to keep your tabs on me, you can follow my social media or my website.

01:05:27 Merrily

Cool.

01:05:28 Merrily

So definitely I'll put all the links in the show.

01:05:31 Merrily

Well, thank you. So.

01:05:32 Merrily

Lane you've already and we close with.

01:05:35 Merrily

You've already shared so much wisdom, but do you have any sort of final words of wisdom that you want to leave us with today?

01:05:43 Lane

Just, you know, search for ancestors and they will find you.

01:05:48 Merrily

Beautifully said.

01:05:51 Merrily

Oh well, thank you so.

01:05:52 Merrily

Mononga this is.

01:05:53 Merrily

I'm so thankful that you made the time to chat with me.

01:05:57 Merrily

You so much.

01:05:59 Lane

I'm happy to do it.

01:06:02 Merrily

I could listen to lane go on for hours as he is a font of knowledge and has really thoughtful and considered ideas around Filipino indigenous practices.

01:06:10 Merrily

Really was an honor. You got to check out the show notes. Learn more about lane and the Catal school and living traditions.

01:06:16 Merrily

Do you remember to like, follow and subscribe on YouTube or your favorite podcast platform?

01:06:20 Merrily

Really helps us.

01:06:21 Merrily

Thank you for listening and being an important part of casual temple.

EPISODE 47 - Lane Wilcken

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